Believe me I am not skeptical of what is done here. Due to a recent loss I have been searching and watching many many YouTube videos of mediums (supposedly) speaking to the dead. While I have great admiration for what is done here, explaining cold readings and even making me realize my own reading wasn't very good after all, I wonder in some cases how things are done. My own reading was kind of vague with no names, actual dates, personal Information but I have see many where psychics do name names and dates and even experiences. Are people really that good at guessing? Can everything really be explained away as just a very good con? I've seen videos where mediums actually name names, I'm not talking about the j name or g name or going into an audience and 'shotgunning'. I'm talking about walking up to someone with a specific name. I know if someone told me my husbands name, a nickname known only to his family that would definitely make a believer out of me! This website has really piqued my curiosity, is there a place here or website that explains how this is done?
I have see many where psychics do name names and dates and even experiences.
Show me a video, and I will show you how they did it. There is hot reading, especially in Churches and public shows, where the medium gathers info before hand.
Are people really that good at guessing?
Depends on the situation. Are you referring to a live show, or something you have seen on the TV? If on the TV it will be highly edited.
Lets say I give a reading to someone, I say 50 names, 3 of them are hits, on the edit, 47 misses are removed, and you only see the 3 hits, suddenly I appear pretty damn amazing right? This is what happens on EVERY single TV show featuring a medium.
Can everything really be explained away as just a very good con?
Yes
I've seen videos where mediums actually name names, I'm not talking about the j name or g name or going into an audience and 'shotgunning'. I'm talking about walking up to someone with a specific name. I know if someone told me my husbands name, a nickname known only to his family that would definitely make a believer out of me! This website has really piqued my curiosity, is there a place here or website that explains how this is done?
As I said previously, show me such videos and I will show you how it was done.
In mediumship there is something known as "The Blue Book", Think of it more as a metaphorical book these days, although sometimes very physical too. Sally Morgan has been write notes to the dead and put them in a giant bowl before her shows, the bowl is then brought out. Whats to say she doesn't have access to these before a show? In a Spiritualist Church they always have a rememberence book, where people leave messages for their lost loved ones. ALL this info is gathered and recorded, regular visitors to the churches have a profile built up on them, all the info learned from what they give away in that book, as well as new info recorded from every reading. Trusted mediums are given access to this "Blue Book" before the show, the only need to memorize bits to come off as knowing names, nicknames and other personal information.
In modern day physical seances, everyone has to leave their handbags outside, guess what, people go through your bags and look for info they can use in the seance.
Look up a book called The Psychic Mafia, by Lemar Keene, written in the late 70s, he was at the time known as The Worlds Greatest Spiritualist Medium, that is until he admitted it was all a con, and went into great detail of how he did it.
Anyway the point is, all mediums cheat, and if you believe in any medium, show me what made you believe, and I guarantee you I will tell you how they did it.
From Doris Stokes to Gordon Higginson, from Derek Acorah to Sally Morgan, From James van Praagh to John Edward. I have exposed them all.
A bad ass who will beat you like he's using the fists of god.
I know she says that he's anxious,a worrier but I could see that from the way he held himself. Also that he would go to uni and it wouldn't be near home. Well most people go away for Uni.
That he would find love in a year. Well he's 19 so at that age it's highly likely. Tried to guess his age but was one year out.
Then she gave info about friends and relatives but some of it was blocked. We don't know if he has an open Facebook.
Going on from the last post I'm sure she said 'Do you know a John'. Lol They always use popular names. I have quite a few relatives called John!
Post by Mr. Jon Donnis on Apr 20, 2016 8:58:10 GMT
Firstly she claims the full gambit of cons, she can read palms (proven to be b***cks), see the past present and future (No one can see the future has it hasn't happened yet, so scientifically impossible any way you look at it) And she can speak to the dead!
Notice how at the start when she is making her claims how much she is fidgeting, hiding her hands, rocking back and forth. These are all signs of a liar. If you had a young child, and they were telling you a lie, they would do all these things would they not? No need to be an expert in psychology to spot that.
Ok at the start of the reading notice how it is edited and she is already in full flow. This knowledge of a Grandfather, I am assuming that she already knew about this as the client will have told her, probably after being asked who she would like to contact.
Again notice the hands, the rocking back and forth, this is a really poor medium, I am guessing she not been doing it long.
At this point we have not seen the client, now if the person being read, is a biggish person, then you can assume that the dead father was also big, and big people tend to die from heart attacks, again because of the edit, we have no idea how much was told at the start of the reading, we cant see the face of the client to see if they are nodding, giving away non verbal clues and so on.
Ok the way the "psychic" is talking, she is just reeling off info very very fast, not even waiting for validation from the client at all, this is a highly edited video, we are not seeing the full story.
Ok this is 100% definitely a hot read, the mediumship part, when she moves onto the palm reading, it is just generalised stuff, cold reading.
The constant editing, the unknown situation of who is being read, how many people are being read, what was known before hand and so on, means this is not a trustable reading and can be dismissed, as it is not in way way controlled.
My opinion, 100% a fraud.
A bad ass who will beat you like he's using the fists of god.
Matt Fraser seems very genuine to me even though you (Jon) did say 100% fraud after watching him on YouTube. I found several appearances on a call in radio show WAAF where I thought he was pretty amazing. Prerty sure there can't be any background checks where people spontaneously call in and give only first names. The hosts of the show are skeptics as well. He also commented on FB that during a reading he saw someones father with a dog and when the woman said no dog, he said the name Abby and it turned out to be her pet rat that just passed. I dont know how someone can pull a name out of a hat like that. In fairness yes it was something he told but there were others cooberating his story on FB who had been to this particular group reading. I have no idea how to link here or I would post the videos.
Matt Fraser seems very genuine to me even though you (Jon) did say 100% fraud after watching him on YouTube. I found several appearances on a call in radio show WAAF where I thought he was pretty amazing. Pretty sure there can't be any background checks where people spontaneously call in and give only first names. The hosts of the show are skeptics as well.
So he is just cold reading, it can sound pretty impressive when done well. Doesn't make t real though.
He also commented on FB that during a reading he saw someones father with a dog and when the woman said no dog, he said the name Abby and it turned out to be her pet rat that just passed.
SO he got it wrong then? He said he saw the father with a dog, this was 100% wrong, so he then threw out a random name in Abby, and the client made the connection and found a RAT to connect it too!
SO the psychic literally did no work here whatsoever, he just said a random name in Abby, a name that has been quite popular over the past 30 odd years, and he got a hit with a pet rat! Are we really to believe that a Rat has spoke to him and given the name Abby!?? Even if rats could speak english we still couldnt understand them as we do not share frames of reference.
I dont know how someone can pull a name out of a hat like that.
It is easy. Let me try. Jon, Dave, Mike, Steve Do any of those names mean anything to you? Seriously, tell me how many people you know, have in your family, or have some connection with that have those names.
In fairness yes it was something he told but there were others cooberating his story on FB who had been to this particular group reading. I have no idea how to link here or I would post the videos.
SO this is a story he has told, not even a recording of a reading Even as a story it is incredibly weak evidence, but as an anecdote it is ridiculous.
You should not even consider this to be evidence.
Personally I know 3 girls with the name Abby/Abbie/Abigail, I dont know any rats though!
A bad ass who will beat you like he's using the fists of god.
Your response made me lol. No I dont know any rats either!! Lol wow I don't think I'm a stupid person but I thought if true which it did seem to be that was kinda amazing. Said a dog ok but then names Abby who is a pet rat who died a week prior. Abby is not a very common name here in US not as far as I know. I do get it though, I want specifics too. I've had a few readings (free) on periscope plus one paid and I've yet to hear specific information that I'm waiting for. Instead of telling my son to be true to himself why not tell him he had better take this new job that had been discussed many times before my husband passed. Or when talking about him why tell us about skating as a kid (no skating) instead of the family vacations we took yearly that were the highlight of his life. His favorite place in the world, the things he liked to do, I just have a hard time getting that. He went by a nickname that he's used since born that everyone called him but I always give his name as his given nAme hoping someone will tell me, they don't. That would be all they have to do. Still, I choose to remain a skeptic not a non believer. I still hope that somehow somewhere he is still out there and I do know that even though he may not be able to communicate it doesn't mean he's not but I have to admit id like to believe that he can. I guess we all would.
Post by Mr. Jon Donnis on Apr 23, 2016 6:33:19 GMT
You should never choose to be a skeptic, you should be a skeptic because there exists no credible evidence for you to believe. In fact there exists no credible evidence in over 100 years of serious scientific study into the paranormal.
A bad ass who will beat you like he's using the fists of god.
Jon I know you are a really busy guy so don't worry if you can't assist me but I'm kinda hoping you can lol.
I am currently engaging with a woman on an atheist forum who has schizophrenia and paid $250 for a telephone reading, she is currently grieving following the loss of both a dear pet and a relative. She does NOT currently sound like her schizophrenia is out of control and is coherent. Inspite of explanations of cold warm and hot reading techniques she is adamant that the telephone psychic got the names of both her grandparents and a sibling with no prompting and has asked me to explain how she could have done this without being really psychic. Not being an expert I have to admit I'm stumped I suspect its hot reading but she denies having social media accounts etc. Is there any explanation for this other than her desire to believe being stronger than her desire to know. I'd like to help her but don't know if I'm bashing my head against a brick wall here or not. Normally I would do my own research but with currently limited internet access and data constraints its difficult. Best wishes and kind regards Adrian.
Jon I know you are a really busy guy so don't worry if you can't assist me but I'm kinda hoping you can lol.
I will try
I am currently engaging with a woman on an atheist forum who has schizophrenia and paid $250 for a telephone reading, she is currently grieving following the loss of both a dear pet and a relative.
First thought. Why is this woman on an atheist forum? Which forum is it? First thought this is someone on the wind up.
She does NOT currently sound like her schizophrenia is out of control and is coherent.
See my first thought!
Inspite of explanations of cold warm and hot reading techniques she is adamant that the telephone psychic got the names of both her grandparents and a sibling with no prompting and has asked me to explain how she could have done this without being really psychic.
"Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem" Translated that means more things should not be used than are necessary.
In other words what is the most likely answer here. To me, this person is simply lying and is trolling an atheist forum.
Not being an expert I have to admit I'm stumped I suspect its hot reading but she denies having social media accounts etc. Is there any explanation for this other than her desire to believe being stronger than her desire to know. I'd like to help her but don't know if I'm bashing my head against a brick wall here or not. Normally I would do my own research but with currently limited internet access and data constraints its difficult.
Best wishes and kind regards Adrian.
Ok a stranger on the internet has told an anecdote. No proof, no evidence, no recording to analyse, just words on a screen. As a skeptic you are in a losing position. So do not engage with their story.
I face this almost every day. An amazing anecdote that I am asked to explain. But if I wasn't there how can I? So in situations like this I am very clear. I say that any opinion i give is worthless, as I have nothing to analyse other than a story. I ask for a recording, I ask for ANY recording. I turn it back on the person making the claim. I challenge them. I usually say something like. "Give me a recording of ANY psychic reading of you, that you are 100% convinced is real, and I will show you how they did it, all I ask is that the recording is unedited"
Usually at that point all the excuses come out, and they run away.
You see a lot of believers will literally make stuff up to try and stump the skeptic or make them look silly. Dont fall into their game.
Remind them that in a court of law eye witness accounts are some of the WEAKEST forms of evidence, and that 10 eye witness accounts all saying the exact same thing, could be thrown out if one piece of DNA evidence contradicts them.
100 Eye witness accounts are worthless is just one piece of CCTV footage shows otherwise.
So we should never trust the word alone of anyone. Ask for evidence, if they cant give you evidence of their direct claim, ask for evidence of ANYTHING they believe in. If they still cant give you anything, well they are on the wind up, and not worth your time.
So yeah forget this persons story, for all you know it is my dad wasting ten minutes while sat on the toilet winding up skeptics!
ps. Message me a link to the exact page the claim was made, and lets see if they look familiar.
A bad ass who will beat you like he's using the fists of god.
Thank you very much Jon, The person concerned has dropped off the Thinking Atheist forum completely so it looks like your hunch about trolling is correct however I personally have learned a lot with regards to critical thinking so I'm very grateful for your reply. I think its unlikely to be your dad unless he is in the habit of trolling multiple times in the same thread and he currently lives in the US. Regards Adey
Thank you very much Jon, The person concerned has dropped off the Thinking Atheist forum completely so it looks like your hunch about trolling is correct however I personally have learned a lot with regards to critical thinking so I'm very grateful for your reply. I think its unlikely to be your dad unless he is in the habit of trolling multiple times in the same thread and he currently lives in the US. Regards Adey
Glad i could help your way of thinking. As for my Dad he knows how to use a simple VPN so easy to pretend to be in the US!
(Disclaimer, My dad doesn't even know how to turn on a computer)
A bad ass who will beat you like he's using the fists of god.
