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Post by leahj on Nov 8, 2006 22:35:37 GMT
Just state one truth about him/her/it. That's all! When you've done that you've proved it exists. The same holds true for anything supernatural. I won't be holding my breath.  |
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Post by whitewolf on Nov 8, 2006 22:39:12 GMT
if only we had been with moses at some stage. then we would all be happy. or would we?
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Post by whitewolf on Nov 8, 2006 22:40:17 GMT
so why do people swear on the bible when taking an oath. weddings? christenings? funerals? its all about god. do we stop them them?
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Post by leahj on Nov 8, 2006 22:59:53 GMT
so why do people swear on the bible when taking an oath. weddings? christenings? funerals? its all about god. do we stop them them? Because christianity is the official religion of the UK. Neither do any of these ceremonies proof that god exists, only that people believe he/she/it does. Do we stop them? Of course not! Everyone should be free to choose what they wish to believe, whether or not it's true. |
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Post by leahj on Nov 8, 2006 23:05:49 GMT
if only we had been with moses at some stage. then we would all be happy. or would we? Assuming he existed and/or that he actually received 'tablets' on which the commandments were written. Would we all be happy? Doubtful. If christianity hadn't come about then people would have 'created' something else to believe in. There are many other religions and it largely depends on where in the world you were born as to which one you'd be raised in. |
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Ess
Sperm
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Post by Ess on Nov 10, 2006 23:36:53 GMT
The state and the curch are linked through a mutually beneficial but archaic bond. It was a primitive but very effective form of control and also financed many wars and caused many more.
The oaths and ceremonies of state have little to do with the existance of God - its simply the ceremony itself which is important.
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Post by whitewolf on Nov 10, 2006 23:40:58 GMT
when i meant happy, i meant we would know of the existence of so many things. Me personally, i see it as one divine force. Its not religion that has caused wars, its leaders of hte religions or countries,
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Post by mesmo on Nov 11, 2006 0:19:45 GMT
Just state one truth about him/her/it. That's all! When you've done that you've proved it exists. The same holds true for anything supernatural. I won't be holding my breath. People believe in his existance - thats a truth! Good job you didn't hold your breath - its been an hour and 45 mins, since your post. (Otherwise you would have to continue your posts via Kendra) |
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Post by leahj on Nov 14, 2006 10:38:08 GMT
Just state one truth about him/her/it. That's all! When you've done that you've proved it exists. The same holds true for anything supernatural. I won't be holding my breath. People believe in his existance - thats a truth! Good job you didn't hold your breath - its been an hour and 45 mins, since your post. (Otherwise you would have to continue your posts via Kendra) That's a truth about peoples' belief, not about god, so sorry, no prize for you!  Sorry about the tardiness of my reply. |
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Post by mesmo on Nov 14, 2006 22:38:18 GMT
People believe in his existance - thats a truth! Good job you didn't hold your breath - its been an hour and 45 mins, since your post. (Otherwise you would have to continue your posts via Kendra) That's a truth about peoples' belief, not about god, so sorry, no prize for you! Sorry about the tardiness of my reply. Call me Mr Picky if you wish but the challenge was to say something ''about'' Him. The point is, belief in any form of entity is a question of faith - not fact. He exists in many many peoples minds - thats a fact. By the same token atheists ''believe'' He doesn't exist. There is no measurable 'proof' in the form the original question was raised - only belief. Mediums believe they talk to dead people - to them its real - same meat different gravy ! |
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Post by leahj on Nov 14, 2006 23:14:28 GMT
That's a truth about peoples' belief, not about god, so sorry, no prize for you! Sorry about the tardiness of my reply. Call me Mr Picky if you wish but the challenge was to say something ''about'' Him. The point is, belief in any form of entity is a question of faith - not fact. He exists in many many peoples minds - thats a fact. By the same token atheists ''believe'' He doesn't exist. There is no measurable 'proof' in the form the original question was raised - only belief. Mediums believe they talk to dead people - to them its real - same meat different gravy ! Hey Mr Picky! I said all you need to do is state a fact about him/her/it, not about peoples' belief in him/her/it. You're building a strawman argument here. Whether or not he/she/it exists in peoples' minds is irrelevant. The fact is that there is no proof he/she/it exists in reality. A few centuries ago almost everyone in the world believed the world was flat but that doesn't change the fact that is isn't. Atheism is abscense of belief in a deity or deities, the 'A' denotes 'lack of', therefore it is not accurate to state that "atheists believe god doesn't exist". It is accurate to say "atheists do not believe god exists". It's a subtle, but vital distinction. The original post still stands. |
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Post by mesmo on Nov 14, 2006 23:52:29 GMT
Definition of Atheism - just looked it up in my 'Collins' - ''the doctrine or BELIEF that there is no God''. I believe thats what I said. Your 'subtle' difference appears to rest on the words 'BELIEVE' and 'NOT BELIEVE'. Sorry if I'm still misunderstanding you but I can't see any difference between your description or mine. But hey call me Mr Thicky Picky!
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Post by leahj on Nov 18, 2006 10:27:42 GMT
Once again, I apologise for the lateness of my reply. Real life has an annoying habit of interfering with my online time. ;D
My dictionary, the Oxford English, published last year, gives the following meanings:
a- (often an- before a vowel) prefix not; without: atheistic. (what a coincidence that they used the very word we're debating as an example!)
Atheism /sy-thi-i-z’m/ noun disbelief in the existence of a god or gods
-DERIVATIVES atheist noun atheistic adjective
- ORIGIN from Greek a- ‘without’ + theos ‘god’
I notice that you haven’t addressed the point in my original post, but perhaps it was an oversight?
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Post by mesmo on Nov 19, 2006 0:27:32 GMT
Sorry (genuinely) if I'm not addressing your original post. I agree that there is no proof that God exists - like I said it is a matter of belief. As a human trait, having a belief in something seems to have been both prevailant and a strong driving force in Humankinds history. To many people, believing in something makes it real e.g Spiritualism, superstitions, mind reading etc. As a race I think Man will always want to believe in something stronger or unexplainable but to many a belief is felt within and is not just because we feel we should believe (my I'm rambling - time to go to bed!!)
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Post by mesmo on Nov 19, 2006 0:34:24 GMT
Actually (just before I get some shut eye) I've read your original post and, thinking about it, there does seem to be a paradox with people like me, who are sceptic about things paranormal, but who also believe there is an omnipotent being overseeing this world we inhabit. To be truthfull, I cant resolve that paradox. But I do believe in what I believe and dont believe in what I think is phoney - probably doesn't help does it? - need more brain pills - night night.
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Post by leahj on Nov 19, 2006 2:24:53 GMT
In reply to both your posts. I agree that it seems to be some sort of a compulsion to believe in something greater that just 'mankind'. Unfortunately, the evidence doesn't support it, though. It took me seven years of searching and questioning to come to the conclusion that no gods exist. When I set out on the journey, I wanted to become closer to the god I believed in and ended up reluctantly concluding that he didn't exist. Even after accepting it, I still held out some hope that I was wrong for quite a few years. That was many years ago, and in all that time I've not found a single reason to doubt my conclusion, in fact, everything points to just the opposite. I've debated in online fora for about nine years now and most of the people I talk to who believe in a god, do not believe in things like fairies, spirits, the Loch Ness Monster and leprechauns for example. I usually advise anyone who asks to apply the same criteria to all things 'supernatural' and if they're honest, they will admit that they have used a different set of criteria for their belief in a god, (special pleading, if you will). Personally, I would love to believe that there is a good and kind being up there who looks out for us, but there is not one single piece of evidence to support it and a great deal of evidence that shows it isn't so. Having said all that, I fully support your right (and almost everyone else's) to believe what they wish. Have a karma point on me for your honesty.  |
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Post by mesmo on Nov 19, 2006 21:37:07 GMT
Thank you leahj, appreciated.
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