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Post by tiger on Dec 11, 2006 3:54:13 GMT
Witches seem to believe that their beliefs are a religion! They take great offense if you try to sweep their beliefs under the rug
(oops). I myself believe they should stop blairing(oops) their
goofy crap. My personal opinion is that they seemed to get burned (oops) when the argument turns to reality. I hate to
dowse their fire brewing around their alleged religion(oops), but
get a life, withcraft is bull sh*t.
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Post by Koolg on Dec 11, 2006 9:49:34 GMT
Witches seem to believe that their beliefs are a religion! They take great offense if you try to sweep their beliefs under the rug (oops). I myself believe they should stop blairing(oops) their goofy crap. My personal opinion is that they seemed to get burned (oops) when the argument turns to reality. I hate to dowse their fire brewing around their alleged religion(oops), but get a life, withcraft is bull sh*t. Coo where is lilac Earthwitch come on Angela tell them the truth |
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Post by Mr. Jon Donnis on Dec 11, 2006 10:20:13 GMT
The problem is that these days anyone with a loopy belief can claim it is their religion and then get the protection of the government for it
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Post by shazzz on Dec 11, 2006 10:42:14 GMT
What a lovely post and how nicely you have put it in a way for us too take you seriously and have a mature debate about it..
What do you beleive in?
Whether we believe or not, I wouldt tell you something you believed in or not was bull sh*t or to get a life...
As I remember Wicca is one of the oldest religions around.
A little more respect and tact next time please, and im sure someone who beleives in whitchcraft would then decide to answer your question for you
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Post by tiger on Dec 11, 2006 12:02:56 GMT
Doubtful
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bex
Sperm
Posts: 76
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Post by bex on Dec 11, 2006 12:07:51 GMT
I'm sure you'll find that if you try to belittle anyone's beliefs then they won't be too happy about it, it's not just wiccans/pagans lol. I studied alot about paganism and witchcraft for 4 years and whilst there is alot that I'm not convinced by, some of the basic principals make sense and are not just a religion but a way of life for many. I decided it wasn't for me, but I do respect other people who practice the craft and I find the whole thing very interesting. Shaz is right, maybe if you raised your points slightly differently and took the time to debate it properly you may get a better response.  |
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Post by tiger on Dec 11, 2006 12:17:22 GMT
If this is a religion that by the way, only has origins that can be traced to the early 1920''s, it's odd the pagan theme. And of
most religions God seems to be an occuring presence,but with
witchcraft we just seem to wing it to believe in whatever. And
of course has one can concede I have my opinion has you do yours.
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Post by shazzz on Dec 11, 2006 12:33:18 GMT
What about pagenism that dates back to before the 14th century though and probaly among the oldest religions around
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Post by Mr. Jon Donnis on Dec 11, 2006 13:51:11 GMT
Yes Shazz, but THAT Paganism involved having sex with horses and making human sacrifices.
I am sure that the majority of modern day pagans do not follow the old religion, and instead follow the type of TV Paganism which involves making nice little spells, wearing purple clothes and having nice jewellry.
Again the point is that these days anyone can claim a loopy belief and get protection from the government.
It doesnt matter howold a religion is, that doesnt make it right or real does it.
Hell i know some people who believe in this bloke who walked on water and could change the weather, hell he even died and came back to life again.
Now that is a loopy religion
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Post by tiger on Dec 11, 2006 21:20:58 GMT
One may think that it's suggested to have ties to the 14 century,
but there is no clear and actual writings to come to this conclusion. If your refering to salem, and old englands beliefs
in witches, that wasn't a religion. The origin of the witch and witchcraft is more folklore than any reality! You can't claim a
religous heritage from a medevil belief brought about by idiots these people sought answers to the unknown by folklore and
stories handed down, that probably changed a hundren times.
I consider witchcraft to be nothing more than desperate people
performing voodoo tricks to satisfy a power they can't acheive any other way. And that includes a bogus power at that!
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Post by mesmo on Dec 12, 2006 0:48:06 GMT
Yes Shazz, but THAT Paganism involved having sex with horses and making human sacrifices. I am sure that the majority of modern day pagans do not follow the old religion, and instead follow the type of TV Paganism which involves making nice little spells, wearing purple clothes and having nice jewellry. Again the point is that these days anyone can claim a loopy belief and get protection from the government. It doesnt matter howold a religion is, that doesnt make it right or real does it. Hell i know some people who believe in this bloke who walked on water and could change the weather, hell he even died and came back to life again. Now that is a loopy religion Sorry - need to take issue with that last statement - a religion is only loopy to those who think it is loopy - it is not loopy to those who do believe in it (seems obvious but can we tone down the generalisations please) Ta. Incidently, wasn't paganism just another pre-christian belief. I think it's got all mixed up today with the 'new age' stuff |
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Post by Amaris on Dec 17, 2006 23:24:04 GMT
I think tiger, you seem to be basing your assumptions about witchcraft on the "new age movement" thing which seems to have gathered momentum these past years. I personally think that almost all of that new age stuff is rubbish.
Witchcraft these days is based on using personal power & positivity to help in life, and it uses the Earth's cycles to help in that. The witches of old were the women of the towns/villages who used natural medicines to help the sick and probably used chanting to aid positive thoughts helping toward healing.
The Wicca thing came about in the 50s with Gerald Gardner but it was based on older ways of life but I do think he filled it with unnecessary ritualistic rubbish, no offence intended to practising witches but I have studied Wicca and felt there wasn't any need for all that ritual.
I also don't think that witches see their practises as a religion.
I have personally found my beliefs through the way of wicca and looking at the way ancient people respected the natural movement and seasons of our earth, it did help me in that respect.
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Post by lilacearthwitch on Dec 18, 2006 12:23:39 GMT
I COULD NOT GIVE A MONKEY'S ARSE ABOUT IT ALL RIGHT NOW. Tiger has his/her opnion granted. So be it. I have mine. So be it. I am not going to get myself dragged into a debate with someone who has embraced this subject in such a immature way. Right now I am just overjoyed by the fact that I don't have cancer and cannot be arsed debating such a subject right now. My motto, "live and live and ye harm none do what you will" Amaris, your views and findings are very worth while. Blessed be |
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Post by lilacearthwitch on Dec 18, 2006 12:31:22 GMT
My own personal views are I want to respect the environment and treat people in the same manner I would like myself to be treated, that is fair, tact when needed, kindness and consideration. Granted that is not always possible in this day and age but that is my belief.
You do not have to practice all the ritualistic nonsense of modern day Wicca or the Gardeneria stuff. It's up to the individual themselves on how involved you want to go into this. I personally don't perform rituals but I try my hardest to live in harmony with the earth's natural cycles and "try" to respect everything and everyone around me. Wicca does teach you aspects of positive thinking and when you feel up against it this kind of teaching can help tremendously.
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Post by abcde on Dec 18, 2006 20:33:15 GMT
I think it's down to how the term 'religion' is used. Most religions have the belief in a supernatural power (God) as it's core tenet. This would rule out most systems like wicca as religions as they tend to be based on 'earth-centred' beliefs - they tend to aim to harmonise with nature rather than worship a god. On the other hand, religion can simply be described as a 'faith-based belief system' in which case wicca et al. are justified in calling themselves religions. None of them, of course, are evidence-based beliefs but give me a wiccan over a born-again christian any day of the week.  |
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Post by mariedew on Jan 12, 2007 3:42:58 GMT
Many Wiccans claim that Wicca is a religion, but in fact it is a made up religion which was invented by Gardener, who wanted to be king of the castle so to speak and made up the whole degree system which includes all this high priestess/priest junk. Wicca and the degree system is for the power hungry witches/pagans who aren't satisfied with practicing their belief's in private.
Witchcraft and Paganism are real belief systems but without the 'we are Gods among mere mortals' ideals of the Wiccans
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Post by abcde on Jan 12, 2007 8:33:14 GMT
Aren't all religions/belief systems made up?
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Post by Mr. Jon Donnis on Jan 12, 2007 9:11:07 GMT
Well modern day Pagans seem to have little to no knowledge of their religions history.
Whether it is human sacrifice or shagging horses, the modern pagans usually have no idea.
Great religion to follow guys.
Hell even the Christians dont have that kind of sick twisted history,
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Post by Me on Jan 12, 2007 10:24:40 GMT
Many Wiccans claim that Wicca is a religion, but in fact it is a made up religion which was invented by Gardener, who wanted to be king of the castle so to speak and made up the whole degree system which includes all this high priestess/priest junk. Wicca and the degree system is for the power hungry witches/pagans who aren't satisfied with practicing their belief's in private. Witchcraft and Paganism are real belief systems but without the 'we are Gods among mere mortals' ideals of the Wiccans You know...me thinks you are going around with the wrong Wiccans. Many of my friends practice this craft,yes indeed I have met some complete and utter egotistical idiots.. But many who i know are far from egotistical and certainly do not view non wiccans as mere mortals.This belief has to be one of the most loveliest and appreciative and humble there is. |
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Post by Me on Jan 12, 2007 10:25:27 GMT
Aren't all religions/belief systems made up? A belief is made up? explain a belief..to wholly 100% to believe in something,whatis it derived from,how did it come about? |
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