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Post by gryfon on Oct 16, 2006 14:59:19 GMT
Well you can only believe in Satan if you're Christian as they made him up. I don't believe in Satan...though as my lovely hubby keeps reminding me (tounge in cheek) that's what he want's me to think so I'll go to hell!  |
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Post by lowrider on Oct 16, 2006 17:50:47 GMT
Well you can only believe in Satan if you're Christian as they made him up. I don't believe in Satan...though as my lovely hubby keeps reminding me (tounge in cheek) that's what he want's me to think so I'll go to hell! I thought all OH/wifes went there.  |
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Post by fromtheotherside on Oct 16, 2006 18:02:53 GMT
I think this just shows how fragmented believe systems are. Orthodox Christianity would have us believe that talking to the dead is talking to Satan in disguise, but the Spiritualist Church use prayer and hymns to raise the vibrations. So, it depends who you're talking to! Which can't be right can it? If only a higher being would intervene and put us straight once and for all! Many beliefs have there own version of spirit, what spirit is,what people are labled as who speak to spirits and so on...Not one is right,nor is one wrong. Another thought.... If we are all splinters of god, then that is also the same for Satan, if that be the case by communicating to one spiritual entity then means you are indeed chatting to Satan as he/she etc would be of that same spirit from that same mould If there is a positive there is also a negative..... Spiritualists do not believe in Satan, yet take on certain aspects that suitthem from that religion...why is that? Because if they did not they would not be deemed a recognised religion and would not be allowed to pratice. There seven principles are ALL supposedly from spirit. Actually any person studious enough to read the history of spiritualism would know that only 5 are from spirit, 2 were added again to be a recognised religion! The end of the day its your own personal truth based upon your own personal experiences that matter. If another disagrees then fine..if they agree then thats cool also. |
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Post by purplechampers on Oct 16, 2006 19:12:38 GMT
Hi Lowrider, happy to explain! I went because I actually had a personal connection with the person that the fundraiser was for, and the believers in the group have always had a healthy respect for my views, as I have theirs. I wasn't there to cause trouble!
As fromtheotherside rightly points out, personal experiences will do more to shape beliefs than anything else. Yet, organised groups/cults/religions will try to make sense of these experiences and provide answers. So if I was a Spiritualist I would believe my experience to be from spirit, and if I was a Christian I would believe that it was Satan in disguise. The same experience, but different interpretations.
So the beliefs of others do influence us, so is unfair to ask them to validate their claims?
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Post by lowrider on Oct 16, 2006 21:04:32 GMT
Hi Lowrider, happy to explain! I went because I actually had a personal connection with the person that the fundraiser was for, and the believers in the group have always had a healthy respect for my views, as I have theirs. I wasn't there to cause trouble! As fromtheotherside rightly points out, personal experiences will do more to shape beliefs than anything else. Yet, organised groups/cults/religions will try to make sense of these experiences and provide answers. So if I was a Spiritualist I would believe my experience to be from spirit, and if I was a Christian I would believe that it was Satan in disguise. The same experience, but different interpretations. So the beliefs of others do influence us, so is unfair to ask them to validate their claims? Emm not always. I do know spiritualist who are a pain in the backside and assume everything is from spirit,again i know many who are very sceptical and require proof before they consider anything spirit. With anyone and any groups there are degrees. |
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Post by whitewolf on Nov 1, 2006 15:56:09 GMT
what a topic. wow. I believe that if we believe in God, then there has to be a devil. But despite everything else, its the free will of people that causes wars. Yes we are all brought up a certain way, told what is right or wrong. But when we grow up and develop, we adopt our own beliefs. People say religion has caused more wars than anything else. Its not the religion, its the interpreation of the writings and philosphies thats the problem. As for the devil controlling psychics, i think he has his handful with other things. Good topic folks.
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Post by Little Claire on Nov 1, 2006 17:11:46 GMT
Religion provides us with this whole good versus evil philosophy. Many men have killed and completely justified their actions because they are representing God and therefore good in the face of evil. You only need to listen to Bin Laden and then to George Bush to hear that the rhetoric they use is frightenly smiliar. I have to wonder what mankind would fight about if they didn't have religion.
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Post by whitewolf on Nov 1, 2006 17:51:08 GMT
thats exactly my point. its leaders or egotiscal maniacs that use a bible or philsophy to justify their greed or madness. They inteperate it to suit their aims and means. Lets face it, where in the bible does it say dont have a blood transfusion.( JW,S) as for the eys for an eye. its not what it means is it.? what peeves me, is sadly the religion issues will never cease. as each faction or religion believs theirs to be the best. they are like companies, they need to have the most members or customers. But imagine this for one moment. if some scientists totally and completely stated there was no god. what would the pope do? Dole queue? what would happen to peoples faith and beliefs? scary innit.
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Post by Little Claire on Nov 1, 2006 20:52:13 GMT
It could never happen. Faith relies on a belief without any proof. Nothing that science could produce would qualify as proof that god doesn't exist.
I think it's more interesting to consider what life would have been like without religion. Does the promise of an afterlife change the way that humans have evolved socially and culturally? Would we have been less or more civilized withoout god? I'm really not sure.
I'm an athiest but I still have a moral code that comes from decency rather than any religious obligation. Perhaps that would have evolved naturally. But maybe I'm naive enough to belief that human beings are inately good.
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Post by whitewolf on Nov 2, 2006 9:38:16 GMT
in the main, humans are. sadly, some take power and greed to the extremes. With many casualties in the process. As a race we need standards and ethics. For me spiritualism is a way of life, not a religion. Its about living your life right. Treating people with equality, and respect. Helping others where possible, applying wisdom and knowledge to evolve.
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Post by Mr. Jon Donnis on Nov 2, 2006 9:43:46 GMT
in the main, humans are. sadly, some take power and greed to the extremes. With many casualties in the process. As a race we need standards and ethics. For me spiritualism is a way of life, not a religion. Its about living your life right. Treating people with equality, and respect. Helping others where possible, applying wisdom and knowledge to evolve. That sounds like a good way to live. But tell me why you need to "talk to the dead" to do these things? Especially if you are not making money from it. Wouldnt it be better to live the spiritualist life, but without this invasion into peoples minds, real or not |
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Post by fromtheotherside on Nov 2, 2006 13:14:21 GMT
Yup and he pays crap wages, and if you try and scam a little overtime  oh dear doenstbare thinkning about..there was onetime this psychic said he did a 20 min reading when it was only 7 mins and The Big S..Goodnesss...................well he grabbed this psychic and...................... |
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Post by whitewolf on Nov 2, 2006 13:55:44 GMT
its not a need. I am not dependant on it. I do what i do. simple. And, i dont talk to the dead as such. they use me, as i agreed to give service before i was born. Yep, another spanner to throw in the works. Personal choice, Jon remember. Its why we all do things. We choose to. So yes i try to live my life without hurting, upsetting, and help where i can. The bonus being i get to meet some great people along my journey. People are important. And if as a person we can help just one, again, just one person, Then life is worth it.
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Post by Mr. Jon Donnis on Nov 2, 2006 15:17:48 GMT
So you help just one person, wow Well done.
Now are you gonna take responsibility for everyone who was convinced by you and are now addicted to psychics? What about those who paid for a reading by a fake? Are you gonna give them their money back?
And i am now to assume that you do past life regressions too?
Kendra, why dont you tell us your opinion on past lives and regressions etc.
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Post by whitewolf on Nov 3, 2006 13:09:03 GMT
The one being helped was an example Jon. As for past life? everyone has their own thoughts on that. I was speaking for myself only. As for addiction? are the any docummented figures to support it? Is there a league table somewhere stating the addiction stats of: alcoholics, drug users? psychic addicts? gamblers? spenders? I agree lots of people visit psychics, i dont doubt that at all. But a true addiction? really?
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Post by whitewolf on Nov 3, 2006 13:12:22 GMT
in fact could addiction be translated as people finding it an interesting subject? trying it out for themselves to formulate their own opinion?
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Post by star on Nov 3, 2006 13:22:27 GMT
Or you could put it another way....... People who are so grief stricken and seek solace in the fake belief that their loved ones are communicating with the person they are paying to tell them that they are still around. It does lead on to them being addicted because they don't want to let go of this hope.  |
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Post by whitewolf on Nov 3, 2006 13:36:05 GMT
i agree with issue of people needing that comfort of a loved ones presence. If the figures of people visiting mediums was broken down, i personally feel, this is a small minority. A lot of people visit for guidance aswell as spirit communication. I dont think a true figure can be established though. But yes, i concur people will seek that comfort. I know its an issue, but again, i dont feel its counts for everyone of the individuals that seek out a medium.
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Post by fromtheotherside on Nov 3, 2006 14:45:03 GMT
in the main, humans are. sadly, some take power and greed to the extremes. With many casualties in the process. As a race we need standards and ethics. For me spiritualism is a way of life, not a religion. Its about living your life right. Treating people with equality, and respect. Helping others where possible, applying wisdom and knowledge to evolve. That sounds like a good way to live. But tell me why you need to "talk to the dead" to do these things? Especially if you are not making money from it. Wouldnt it be better to live the spiritualist life, but without this invasion into peoples minds, real or not Jon you plum!!!!! Part of the spiritualists belief is that the spirit world do communicate in varying ways back to us.. Get it right matey before you make statements like that!Good god man! |
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Post by fromtheotherside on Nov 3, 2006 14:52:55 GMT
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oh dear doenstbare thinkning about..there was onetime this psychic said he did a 20 min reading when it was only 7 mins and The Big S..Goodnesss...................well he grabbed this psychic and......................
