yes Sceptics who are also non believers in God and Christ are hypocrites for celebrating Christmas. How can someone celebrate a festival that they don't believe in. They most probably max out on credit cards spending money they can ill afford and for what........... because they don't want to be left out. Giving each other small gifts is supposed to represent the gifts the baby Jesus received from the Three Wise Men but they all go overboard and put themselves in debt for months, no reflection of the true meaning of the special time of Jesus's birth. They don't have the courage of their convictions and ignore a festival they have no right to celebrate.
Zeus is wrong when he says the sceptics have proved they are not wrong by celebrating Christmas. They have proved nothing of the sort!
Stick to your guns girl!
So all non believers have CCJ's for debt and believers only buy small gifts for each other? And we have "no right to celebrate"! Bloody well says who??? How dare you call yourself a Christian and then post such a derogatory post about non believers, "but they all go overboard and put themselves in debt for months"
exactly. You can't celebrate something you don't believe in.
How dare you call yourself a Christian and then post such a derogatory post about non believers,
It's because I'm a Christian I can celebrate Christ's birth so what is derogatory about saying non believers shouldn't. You are either a believer or not and if you are not it stands to reason that the true meaning of Christmas is lost on you.
Bloody well says who???
tut tut a tad upset are we at someone questioning your reason for celebrating Christmas.
tut tut a tad upset are we at someone questioning your reason for celebrating Christmas.
from where i'm standing it would seem that you are more upset about people celebrating christmas who dont necessarily believe in christianity than someone who's been told they have no right to celebrate it....whats the problem? i thought christians were all about live and let live and sharing love... do you wanna keep it all to urself or something while we non religious types look in thru ur windows shiffering our arses off feeling glum while we watch you exchange presents and get plastered on wine and turkey and dancing round ur tree listening to slade? whats the big deal! make ur own reality, make ur own festival...jesus doesnt mind...honest...god wants us to come up with our own ideas yknow?
Post by Little Claire on Nov 13, 2006 11:51:37 GMT
The 25th December was a pagan festival centuries before the christians adopted it. I think it was traditionally the birthday of the sun god and it's all linked in with the winter solstice. The festival used to move dates with the solstice. The Roman church adopted the festival much later.
And nearly all religions and cultures have a festival of light in the winter it just happens that my celebrations include a load of LED's and icicle lights.
I am an athiest but I make no apologies for celebrating christmas. It's a great boost to the spirit during the winter months and to me has nothing to do with the birth of Jesus and eveything to do with the lengthening of the days and a celebration of the return of the sun. You don't have to be religious to celebrate that
"exactly. You can't celebrate something you don't believe in" Once again, says bloody who?? I shall do whatever I please regardless of what alleged Christians say.
"It's because I'm a Christian I can celebrate Christ's birth so what is derogatory about saying non believers shouldn't. You are either a believer or not and if you are not it stands to reason that the true meaning of Christmas is lost on you."
Easy to say you are a Christian, BEING one is different. What is derogatory, and very UN Christian is to say that non believers "all go overboard and put themselves in debt for months" But, obviously as a Christian you will know Luke 6:37-38,
Do not judge others, and God will not judge you, do not condemn others and God will not condemn you.
"The true meaning of Christmas is lost on you" You mean in a Christian sense, no, not lost on me at all, I understand the sentiments perfectly. There are other festivals to celebrate at that time of year, ones that don't involve Jesus.
"Giving each other small gifts is supposed to represent the gifts the baby Jesus received from the Three Wise Men"
Again, for a practicing Christian, that sounds lovely, but in a sense you're wrong. Gift giving has its historical origin in an ancient pre-Christian tradition. During the ancient Roman celebration of Saturnalia, the harvest festival, small candles and clay figures were given. At Calens, the Roman new-year, more elaborate gifts were exchanged. The Romans believed that sweet gifts would ensure a good year, so fruits, honey, and cakes were popular gifts. Evergreen branches, were given as symbols of continuous health and strength. Wealthy Romans gave each other gold coins for good luck. Everyone gave gifts, children gave to their teachers, slaves gave to their masters, and the people gave to their emperor. Even though the three kings and others gave presents to the baby Jesus, gift giving did not become an established part of the Christmas celebration until several centuries after the birth of Christ.
Because the early Christians did not want their religion to be associated with pagan festivals, they shunned gift giving as a pagan practice. It was in the middle ages that gift giving began to be part of the Christmas tradition. The kings of England, like the emperors of Rome, demanded gifts from their subjects. The common people also exchanged gifts, but only among the wealthy were elaborate gifts given. The poor exchanged trinkets and entertained each other with songs and parties and plays.
"tut tut a tad upset are we at someone questioning your reason for celebrating Christmas."
Not one bit, I have stated quite clearly why I do what I do at Christmas, why would that upset me? What annoys me is having people who claim to be Christians without actually following a Christian lifestyle. You believe in Jesus, and that the bible is the word of God, so why do you not follow its teachings?
2 Timothy 2:22-25, Shun youthful passions and pursue righteousness, faith, love, and peace, along with those who call on the Lord from a pure heart. Have nothing to do with stupid and senseless controversies; you know that they breed quarrels. And the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome but kindly to everyone, an apt teacher, patient, correcting opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant that they will repent and come to know the truth.
Philippians 2:3-4 says, "Do nothing out of selfish ambition or vain conceit, but in humility consider others better than yourselves. Each of you should look not only to your own interests, but also to the interests of others."
And I hope to hell you've never worked on a Sunday, thats the 4th commandment up the spout.
In summery, a "Christian" telling someone they have "no right" to do something. I think you need a bible study course if you are going to continue with this chosen faith.
Post by fromtheotherside on Nov 13, 2006 13:56:46 GMT
cheyanne71 said:
Hi Kendra,
yes Sceptics who are also non believers in God and Christ are hypocrites for celebrating Christmas. How can someone celebrate a festival that they don't believe in. They most probably max out on credit cards spending money they can ill afford and for what........... because they don't want to be left out. Giving each other small gifts is supposed to represent the gifts the baby Jesus received from the Three Wise Men but they all go overboard and put themselves in debt for months, no reflection of the true meaning of the special time of Jesus's birth. They don't have the courage of their convictions and ignore a festival they have no right to celebrate.
Zeus is wrong when he says the sceptics have proved they are not wrong by celebrating Christmas. They have proved nothing of the sort!
Post by fromtheotherside on Nov 13, 2006 14:03:29 GMT
admin said:
Me Arrogant..Pot calling Kettle black me thinks.
I will happily admit i can be arrogant.
How many times have you rang me up, going off on a rant because of something you have misread, or misunderstood?
Not always misread Jon or misunderstood!
You refuse to back down because you hate being proven wrong. And it is worse when it is on a public forum such as this, as you dont want to look weak.
Who likes being wrong? No one likes being wrong! But the only weakness I see in being worng is not being able to accept you are wrong! Accepting and likeing it are two different things.
I will happily apologise when i am wrong, i see no point in sticking to a point when i know i am wrong.
Oh behave
There is no substance in your original post, sceptics have proved that they are not hypocrites regarding celebrating xmas, they have given you good critical debate, and you cant stand it
They have proved nothing,infact they have confirmed my original posting...
Am I wrong?
umm yup
You admit you do the whole John Edward thing of refusing to admit you are wrong during giving a reading, basically shoving it down their throat until they accept it
sigh, I dont shove nothing down anyones throat! What I do not agree in doing is changing the info to make things fit,and so stick to my guns about my interpretation.
Dictating? lol If i was a dictator, i wouldnt let you on this forum. I wouldnt let Shazz boss me about, i wouldnt let Mia and Littleclaire delete MY OWN THREADS. And i wouldnt have a bloody medium be an admin on here.
Jon you have the final say and you know it!
Who is this God chap? have you met him?
Please dont make me start going into the I see god in every flower,hear god in a childs laugh thing..please dont make me do it Jon..please..please I beg you
No wonder we get along so well Jon
We get along Kendra,because i am not scared by you, Iam not intimidated by you, and because i took everything you had, everything you could throw at me, and I stood up tall.
Yeah because thats hard to do when your over 6ft isnt it Jon
Whether you like it or not Kendra, you like me for those very reasons. You hate all the yes men (women lol) who have told you you are so great all your life. All the noobs who surround you.
You like me Kendra, because i am not a noob. Plain and simple.
And I like you, because you are an arrogant, know it all who wont back down!
umm ok..sniff sniff. not sure what to say to that...all choked up now
Post by fromtheotherside on Nov 13, 2006 14:11:40 GMT
monstermeercat said:
littleclaire said:
Perhaps we need to ask What is the true meaning of christmas?
It has bugger all to do with Christianity for me
I agree. Or even "what does Christmas mean to you as individual"
So, if Christmas to you guys,has nothing to do with Christianity or the birth of Jesus or the spirit of Christmas!!! If it is as you say,a time to get together with friends,give gifts to people you care about, share special moments together with the ones you love. If Christianity has bog all to do with Christmas for you guys..Why do you do all this on 25th of December? Why not at any other time of the year?Why do you wait an entire year to get together with the people you love,share gifts with each other to show you care, tokens of your love etc, arranging parties and meetings with people you haven't seen for yonks. If your not using Christmas to your own advantage(which is hypocrytical)....you can do all the above in Jan,Feb,march whenever.. So why don't you?
Last Edit: Nov 13, 2006 14:13:20 GMT by fromtheotherside
Post by Mr. Jon Donnis on Nov 13, 2006 14:20:35 GMT
Not always misread Jon or misunderstood!
How many times have you fallen out with me, because YOU misunderstood something? How many verbal volleys have you thrown my way because of YOUR mistakes? And how many times have you actually apologised?
Who likes being wrong? No one likes being wrong! But the only weakness I see in being worng is not being able to accept you are wrong! Accepting and likeing it are two different things.
You hate to admit you are wrong. I am happy to admit when i am wrong as it helps me move forward and learn
sigh, I dont shove nothing down anyones throat! What I do not agree in doing is changing the info to make things fit,and so stick to my guns about my interpretation.
But that is aggression, and it makes you look like a fraud.
Yeah because thats hard to do when your over 6ft isnt it Jon
Nothing to do with my height, more to do with my ability to adapt and excell
Whether you like it or not Kendra, you like me for those very reasons. You hate all the yes men (women lol) who have told you you are so great all your life. All the noobs who surround you.
You like me Kendra, because i am not a noob. Plain and simple.
And I like you, because you are an arrogant, know it all who wont back down!
umm ok..sniff sniff. not sure what to say to that...all choked up now
You josh, but you know its true. And thats why my opinion counts for more than anyone else you know (outside of your family)
A bad ass who will beat you like he's using the fists of god.
Post by Little Claire on Nov 13, 2006 14:21:51 GMT
fromtheotherside said:
monstermeercat said:
I agree. Or even "what does Christmas mean to you as individual"
So, if Christmas to you guys,has nothing to do with Christianity or the birth of Jesus or the spirit of Christmas!!! If it is as you say,a time to get together with friends,give gifts to people you care about, share special moments together with the ones you love. If Christianity has bog all to do with Christmas for you guys..Why do you do all this on 25th of December? Why not at any other time of the year?Why do you wait an entire year to get together with the people you love,share gifts with each other to show you care, tokens of your love etc, arranging parties and meetings with people you haven't seen for yonks. If your not using Christmas to your own advantage(which is hypocrytical)....you can do all the above in Jan,Feb,march whenever.. So why don't you?
You should have read my previous posts Kendra. Why do you celebrate the 25th December. It's quite a recent addition to the christian calendar relatevely speaking. The 25th December is traditionally celebrated as the birthdate of the sun god. It coincides with winter solstice and the return of the sun, longer days and shorter nights and all that. I celebrate light and feast in the dark winter months. Exchanging presents and eating has nothing to do with the birth of Jesus. So christmas is as much mine as yours
Post by Mr. Jon Donnis on Nov 13, 2006 14:23:34 GMT
If Christianity has bog all to do with Christmas for you guys..Why do you do all this on 25th of December?
Why not?
Why should we stop our kids from celebrating on this day? When all their friends are?
The shops are closed, work is closed, so what are we to do? The TV is full of Christmas programmes.
Do we sit in darness and silence, waiting for the day to pass? Or do we enjoy the holidays and be part of the fun?
Hell you celebrate xmas, and you are not even a proper christian.
Why not at any other time of the year?Why do you wait an entire year to get together with the people you love,share gifts with each other to show you care, tokens of your love etc, arranging parties and meetings with people you haven't seen for yonks. If your not using Christmas to your own advantage(which is hypocrytical)....you can do all the above in Jan,Feb,march whenever.. So why don't you
In the Greek culture we actually give presents on News years, we celebrate that much more than xmas.
And we invented the bloody bible!!
A bad ass who will beat you like he's using the fists of god.
Post by fromtheotherside on Nov 13, 2006 14:31:35 GMT
littleclaire said:
fromtheotherside said:
So, if Christmas to you guys,has nothing to do with Christianity or the birth of Jesus or the spirit of Christmas!!! If it is as you say,a time to get together with friends,give gifts to people you care about, share special moments together with the ones you love. If Christianity has bog all to do with Christmas for you guys..Why do you do all this on 25th of December? Why not at any other time of the year?Why do you wait an entire year to get together with the people you love,share gifts with each other to show you care, tokens of your love etc, arranging parties and meetings with people you haven't seen for yonks. If your not using Christmas to your own advantage(which is hypocrytical)....you can do all the above in Jan,Feb,march whenever.. So why don't you?
You should have read my previous posts Kendra. Why do you celebrate the 25th December. It's quite a recent addition to the christian calendar relatevely speaking. The 25th December is traditionally celebrated as the birthdate of the sun god. It coincides with winter solstice and the return of the sun, longer days and shorter nights and all that. I celebrate light and feast in the dark winter months. Exchanging presents and eating has nothing to do with the birth of Jesus. So christmas is as much mine as yours
Ahhh I see from where you are coming..thats cool LC,because you are celebrating one way or another from a belief. p.s I know many festivals etc from the Christian Calendar were pinched by the church. But the sceptics on here are neither Wiccans nor pagans,they do not believe in any spiritual entity, elemental, god or goddess!
So christmas is as much mine as yours
It most certainly is
Last Edit: Nov 13, 2006 14:33:32 GMT by fromtheotherside
?? How dare you call yourself a Christian and then post such a derogatory post about non believers, "but they all go overboard and put themselves in debt for months" 
Oh behave
